this time it's called the debt ceiling debate. former senator alan simpson is co-founder of the campaign to fix the debt and the former debt commissioner co-chair. he's been an outspoken advocate of getting our spending under control, and he joins us right now in a cnbc exclusive. senator, good to have you on the program. thanks for joining us. >> it's a pleasure always doing that with you. >> we've read simpson/bowles. know you recommend spending cuts, but do you believe the gop should be using the debt ceiling as a leverage point to get to the president to agree to the cuts? >> i think that would be a grave mistake. i don't think that would solve anything. i know they are going to try it, and how far they will go with the guam of chicken, i have no idea, but i can tell you can't -- you really can't -- this is stuff that we've already indebted ourselves. i mean, if you're a real conservative, really honest conservative without hypocrisy, you would want to pay your debt, and that's what this is. they are not running up anything ne